she was also a screenwriter and novelist -- put herself through barnard writing genre fiction; I just posted her filmography (and some lists of female poets in the Harriet Monroe POETRY circle, and others) HERE

mentioning The Little Room salon / reading series

truthfully, much of the action as far as readings before wwi go, salons, talks, and "artistic evenings" not limited to poetry, at arts organizations (such as The Modern School), or sponsored by / fundraising for little magazines, arts organizations, unions, other political organizations, and causes (suffrage, birth control) were quite popular -- Lola Ridge's salon was one of the hottest in the east village, for example. But the whole reading at rallies thing.

ADM was a member of the Algonquin Round Table, a later, permanent salon, although I don't know how much reading and reciting took place at that one!

another thought I had, thinking about foetry and the list as well as public readings, is that in the past, as someone mentioned, it was not acceptable especially for upper middle class or society women, to appear in public, or even, in most cases, to publish

what this resulted in -- and this is why I am thinking of it -- it the over-emphasis on contests and also, if not self-publication, partially-funded publication, rather than actually networking and establishing an audience to achieve book publication, rather than supporting publication through touring / readings, writing reviews, etc.

[making Amy Lowell even more of a groundbreaker; everyone seems to forget she wrote a satirical long poem -- most of the chataquans did it for cash -- in some respects, this lecture circuit could be like a puritan / rural vaudeville or like a traveling tent revival]

-----Original Message-----

Ah ha! There was a whole subgenre of suffrage poetry at that time! What about fishing around in there? Surely suffrage meetings ca. 1910 would have been the place where many women poets read!

Check this paper on Alice Duer Miller, heretofore completely unknown to me:



Ella Young

The Rose of Heaven: Poems
Illustrated by Maude Gonne

Candle Press, 1920

The Weird of Fionavar
Talbot Press, 1922

Aileen Fisher
Dorothy Mason Pierce
Edwina Fallis
Dorothy Brown Thompson
Marian J. Rosenzweig
(Mary Frances Butts)
(Frances Frost)
Mary Catherine Parsons
Dorothy Aldis (not mary -- 1923 poems)
Olive Beaupre Miller
Polly Chase Boyden
Mary Austin -- her poems, not land of little rain
Annette Wynne
Rosemary Carr
Nancy Boyd Turner
Eleanor Farjean
Elizabeth Coatsworth
Elinor Chipp, The City and Other Poems, Four Seas Co., 1922
Elizabeth Madox Roberts, The Rainbow Cat, 1922; The Fairy Green, 1919; Fairies and Chimneys
Rose Fyleman
Mary Britton Miller
Carmen Bernos de Gasztold
Winnifred Welles
Rachel Field, California FAiry Tales, 1926
Monica Shannon
Wanda Gag
Carlyn Wells, Baubles, Dodd, Mead, 1917; The Lover's baedecker, tons of stuff including nonsense verse
Laura E. Richards
Mary E. Wilkins Freeman, can only find short stories
Mildred Howells, WD Howells' daughter
Mildred Plew Meigs
Ethel Talbot, London Windows, 1912
Ella Young (see above)

anybody want to give me free access to an academic library???
florence Wilkinson
Edith Wyatt
Agnes Lee
Margery Curry

Olive Tilford Dargen
Julia CR Dorr
Josephine Preston Peabody
Edith Thomas

Harriet Monroe and copyright -- won a reprint suit -- some funds from that

Arthur & Owen Aldis = Chicago real estate firm, Mary Aldis' husband, connected to Poetry through a salon called The Little Room

Marguerite Wilkinson
Theodosia Garrison
Alice Maynell


Grace Fallow Norton
Violet Hunt Hueffer
Fannie Stearns Davis
Margaret Root Garvin
Florence Earle Gates
Isabele Howe Fiske -- rel. to Arthur Fiske???
Amelia Josephine Burr
Margaret Widdemer
Emilia Stuart Lorimer
Helen Dudley
Margaret French Patton
Helen Hoyt -- poet -- worked int he poetry office
Louise Driscoll
Louise Ayers Garnett
Antoinette DeCoursey
Georgia Wood Pangbourne
Constance Lindsay Skinner

west coast indian songs
more common mainstream advice about manuscripts

aside from -- can you wedge your collection or your "greatest hits" into the current fad for very unified projects" -- is this stuff


no puns, but quirky and catchy, but not too cute
solid, concrete, imagistic or uncommon words, unusual, but not too unusual -- avoid obscure references
think about internet search engines being able to find your book
avoid vaporous titles with words like blood, heart, justice...
don't use a color
don't use a title of something else

author photos

sell more books, especially if the author is ugly
don't look silly
don't include your pet
avoid showing both ears, or your hands


the blurb is technically the description (which the author generally writes); what we call blurbs are mini "pre-reviews" from readers, critics, writers, usually more accomplished than you are

blurbs are advertising

authors ask for blurbs

don't ask for more than you will use

query for blurbs
manifesti from the early 20s in California

Society of Six

we believe

all great art is founded upon the use of visual abstractions to express beauty

these abstractions are:

space (3D form)
atmosphere (air)
vibration (life, movement)
form (length and breadth)
and form of accidents (persons, trees, etc.)

patterns is the means by which abstractions are arranged and united so as to procure an aesthetic end

by pattern we mean:

tone, etc.

Form, i.e., objects, is accidental and transitory, except in its large sense - space. That the object we see happens to be a man instead of a tree or another object is an accident, since if we look a few feet to one side we see an entirely different object. Form is also destroyed and distorted by light, color, vision, space -- in other words, its visual existence is by grace of larger abstractions. We choose the greater rather than the lesser, inasmuch as painting is interpretation rather than representation, and it is only by sacrifice of the lesser of the lesser that we can express the greater with the most force.


We do not believe that painting is a language. Nor do we try to 'say" things, but we try to fix upon the canvas the joy of vision. To express, to show -- not to write hyroglyphics. We have no concern with stories, with lapse of time, nor with the probability or improbability... we are not trying to illustrate a thought or write a catalog... we have much to express, but nothing to say. We have felt, and desire that others may also feel.


stanton macdonald-wright of la (later ucla prof; I took one of my last haiku classes to LACMA's retrospective; he'd illustrated basho, et.al., had seemingly a conversion to buddhism / buddhist style painting)

the purile repetition of the surface aspects of the masters has ceased to interest any intellident man. the modern artist striving to express his own age... cannot be expected to project himself with any degree of sureness five hundred years back and drag forth by the aid of [necromancy] the corpse of an art inspired and nourished by a period environment... let our final work affect you as it will, but let not your final opinion be the result of some preconceived antagonism.

... The apparent preference, in the past, for dead form, is not so much a preference arising from free selection as a habit due to the fact that any new work of an evolutionary character has been ... withheld from public view...
Los Angeles: Sunday, February 26, 2006, 7:30 PM
reading with Elizabeth Treadwell & Christine Wertheim
in the Make Now Series at the Smell
247 South Main Street,
downtown LA between 2nd and 3rd -- doors at 6:30.

Elizabeth Treadwell's fifth book, Cornstarch Figurine,
will be published this year by Dusie Press. She lives
with her husband and young daughter in Oakland CA
where she is working on a manuscript titled Birds &
Fancies. More info: elizabethtreadwell.com

Christine Wertheim is a faculty member of the School
of Critical Studies at the California Institute of the
Arts. Her critical work has recently appeared in
X-tra, the LA Weekly, and Signs, as well as numerous
art catalogues and artists monographs. With Matias
Viegener, she edited Seance for Make Now Press.
female poet's films

Alice Duer Miller

Tangier (1946) (story)
On Borrowed Time (1939)
The Girl on the Front Page (1936)
Rose-Marie (1936)
... aka Indian Love Call (USA: TV title)
... aka Rose Marie (USA: poster title)
Disgraced! (1933) (also story)
The Keyhole (1933) (story Adventuress)
The Bridge of San Luis Rey (1929)
Man-Made Woman (1928)
Four Walls (1928)
Two Lovers (1928) (adaptation)
Man, Woman and Sin (1927)
The Devil Dancer (1927)
Altars of Desire (1927)
Valencia (1926) (also story)
... aka The Love Song
The Boy Friend (1926) (adaptation)
Exquisite Sinner (1926)
Monte Carlo (1926/I) (also adaptation)
Pretty Ladies (1925)
Lady of the Night (1925)
Cheaper to Marry (1925)
So This Is Marriage? (1924)
Slave of Desire (1923) (adaptation)
Red Lights (1923) (adaptation)
Fourteenth Lover (1922) (story)

Lovely to Look at (1952) (novel Gowns By Roberta)
Spring in Park Lane (1948) (book Come Out of the Kitchen)
The White Cliffs of Dover (1944) (poem)
Forever and a Day (1943)
Irene (1940)
And One Was Beautiful (1940) (novel) (story)
Wife vs. Secretary (1936) (screenplay)
Collegiate (1936)
... aka Charm School (UK)
Roberta (1935) (novel Gowns by Roberta)
Come Out of the Pantry (1935) (book Come Out of the Kitchen)
Big Executive (1933) (story)
Jede Frau hat etwas (1931) (play Come Out of the Kitchen)
Incorregible, La (1931) (novel)
Salga de la cocina (1931) (play Come Out of the Kitchen)
... aka Dulce como la miel (USA: Spanish title)
... aka Suegra para dos (USA: Spanish title)
Kärlek måste vi ha (1931) (play)
Lika inför lagen (1931) (novel Manslaughter)
Réquisitoire, Le (1931) (novel)
Chérie (1930) (play Come Out of the Kitchen)
Princess and the Plumber (1930) (story)
Manslaughter (1930) (novel)
Honey (1930) (book Come Out of the Kitchen)
Leichtsinnige Jugend (1930) (novel)
Someone to Love (1928) (novel The Charm School)
Are Parents People? (1925)
Manslaughter (1922) (novel)
Man with Two Mothers (1922) (story)
Ladies Must Live (1921) (novel)
The Charm School (1921) (story) (play)
Her First Elopement (1920) (novel) (as Clara Bartram) (story)
Something Different (1920) (novel Calderon's Prisoner)
Come Out of the Kitchen (1919) (book)
Less Than Kin (1918) (story)
The Firefly (1937) (treatment) (uncredited)
female poet's films;

Dorothy Parker
Writer - filmography

The Lovely Leave (1999) (short story)
T'odio, amor meu (1996) (TV) (work)
Women and Men: Stories of Seduction (1990) (TV) (story Fireworks Before Dusk)
Ladies of the Corridor (1986) (TV)
Big Blonde (1980) (TV) (short story)
... aka Dorothy Parker's Big Blond (USA: complete title)
A Star Is Born (1954) (1937 screenplay)
Queen for a Day (1951) (story Horsie)
... aka Horsie
The Fan (1949)
... aka Lady Windermere's Fan (UK)
Smash-Up: The Story of a Woman (1947) (story)
... aka A Woman Destroyed (UK)
... aka Smash-Up
Saboteur (1942) (original screenplay)
Weekend for Three (1941) (screenplay)
The Little Foxes (1941) (additional scenes and dialogue)

Trade Winds (1938)
Sweethearts (1938)
The Cowboy and the Lady (1938) (uncredited)
Woman Chases Man (1937) (uncredited)
A Star Is Born (1937) (screenplay)
Lady Be Careful (1936)
Suzy (1936)
The Moon's Our Home (1936)
Three Married Men (1936)
One Hour Late (1935)
Here Is My Heart (1934) (uncredited)
Remodeling Her Husband (1920) (titles)

Leonard Bernstein: Candide (2003) (TV) (additional lyricist)
Candide (1989) (TV) (lyricist)
... aka Bernstein Conducts Candide (USA)
Candide (1986) (TV) (lyricist)
... aka Live from Lincoln Center: Candide (USA: series title)
Pandora and the Flying Dutchman (1951) (lyricist: "How am I to Know?") (uncredited)
The Hoodlum Saint (1946) (lyricist: "How Am I To Know") (uncredited)
The Big Broadcast of 1936 (1935) (lyricist: "I Wished on the Moon")
Dynamite (1929) (lyricist: "How Am I to Know") (uncredited)
Send Me a Telegram

Will you please?
and have it delivered like a pineapple today
not yesterday's pineapple but really I would prefer
a daily pineapple if you can arrange it I mean
with a telegram not always a telegram a yearly
one will be sure if it reaches me
if first it goes on an air land and later comes
to me by foot I will like it better than a telegram
read to me over a telephone I would like this
new and fresh telegram to arrive with an old-
fashioned person dressed in a delivery suit
the words will be so contemporary so avant-garde
it being you who shall send it but I can discard
that idea I should like an ordinary person to deliver
my telegram not necessarily in a delivery-suit one
must respect tastes and not parenthesize them as
telegrams do not risk punctuation and my joy in
receiving your words hardly needs embellishment
I almost forgot oh genuine you of delicious pineapples
thank you in advance as you have always wished.


--Barbara Guest

in The Blind See Only This World: Poems for John Weiners
[New York: Granary Books, 2000]

like many (3rd gen NYS, female) younger poets in California, I had the privilege of reading with Barbara Guest -- Andrew Maxwell gave me the opportunity

she has been a favorite of mine -- I've quoted her many times, return to her work frequently -- for quite some time

would that she, and her "foremother" (as the WOMPO list would have it) HD (Guest wrote HERSELF DEFINED) were better mothers, but couldn't have been a better poet...


I'm glad someone posted about the first and last poemthing; does it work? Sure, to an extent, in the same way that if you are submitting to a journal, you want the best poem first, or you are putting together a CD, you generally want to be -- if not the "hit" - thoe most immediately "catchy" piece first

unless of course you are a classical musician or a project based poet, in which case the project starts where it starts

but what about those emergent patterns, those scary changes in voice and theme -- those sticky problems that come from writing _over time_ -- ??


bummer this is opposite bernadette mayer's reading!

SATURDAY - FEBRUARY 18, 2006 8PM $10/door

Sesshu Foster
reads from his new novel Atomik Aztex accompanied by live music.
selected one of the top 25 books of the year by the Village Voice.
Poet Amy Uyematsu
author of Nights of Fire, Nights of Rain, 30 Miles from J-town and Stone Bow Prayer

"If the Aztecs had defeated the conquistadores and had eventually become the mainstream, what would our world be like? Where is Teknotitlán located? In Robo-Los Angeles, Mexico D.F., or in the imagination of Sesshu Foster? If Ancient America had triumphed over savage capitalism, chicanismo would be the (poetical, political, and spiritual) center of it all. Atomik Aztex is a graphic, hilarious and violent chronicle of multiple realities that could emerge out of this proposition. It's an amazing exercise of radical imagination." - Guillermo Gómez-Peña

continuing in the gallery
February 4 - March 4, 2006

Conversation with Arturo Romo
Thursday, February 23, 2006 7:30 pm

Gallery Hours: Tu- Fri 12 - 4 pm; Sat - 1 - 5 pm and by appointment

Tropico de Nopal Gallery-Art Space
1665 Beverly Blvd.
(between Belmont and Union, 1 mile west of downtown LA)
(Echo Park)Los Angeles, CA 90026 213.481.8112

Tropico de Nopal Gallery-Art Space is an independent gallery dedicated to exhibiting and promoting contemporary emerging and mid-career artists through cross-cultural and multi-disciplinary art forms.
this seems to be a more arguable section, but again, I think it is exceptionally common right now to think of mss this way, no matter the aestetic or practice --

5) When organizing the manuscript, you are attempting to create nothing less than a work of art. You want to think about what your book is “about,” and include poems that carry that theme or themes, that are somehow related, that “speak” to each other. Also, I find that it’s a good idea to bring poems together that are written more or less in the same creative period, less they sound as though written by different poets – a different you. By this, I don’t mean to suggest that a book need be written in any particular timeframe, but rather that the book include poems written during a period (a year, two years, five years, whatever) when you are writing in a particular way. Every time we write a poem we announce to the world what we think a poem is. The poems you write when urging – wittingly or unconsciously – a particular aesthetic are the ones that belong in the same book. Spread all of your poems out on the floor, a floor that does not need to be disturbed, and look at them. Read them. Live with them. See what relationships seem to be developing between the poems. Which poem wants to talk to that poem? Where do you see common images developing, or growing out of each other? In what directions do your various threads lead? What seem to be your concerns as a poet during this period of creativity, and how do they seem to want to group. The process of inclusion and ordering is organic, calculated, thoughtful, instinctual, unconscious, and a somewhat Zen. You need time to permit all of those matters and anti-matters to work upon you, and upon your poems.

6) Continue to think about each poem according to: mood / tone; dominant images, characters / speaker, setting/season; chronology, and whatever other categories you deem important to your own work. However you organize your collection, keep in mind that you are creating a book, and you cannot really know how the poems interact with each other unless you've done this work. Make multiple copies of each poem, try different orders with duplicate books, and live with them for awhile.

7) Make sure the poems that begin your collection establish the voice and credibility of the manuscript. They should introduce the questions, issues, characters, images, and sources of conflict/tension, etc., that concern you and that will be explored in the book. Think about the trajectory of the manuscript: you want to set the reader off on a journey, a path toward some (even if undisclosed) destination, but forget about “arc.” The notion of “arc” is, in my opinion, too willful to be successful in any artistic undertaking. Make the book work, and then let others talk about your “arc.”

8) Just because a poem has been previously published does not mean that you are required to leave it alone. Rethink, re-enter, and if possible, re-vision each poem as if the Paris Review had never taken it.

9) Find an effective title: from the title of a significant poem in your collection, or from a line in one of your poems, or from one of your epigraphs, or something that may not appear verbatim in your collection at all, but some how signifies, or shapes the manuscript. That said, create about a dozen different titles and live with each for a while. Print out a title page for each possibility, tack them to a bulletin board or the refrigerator, and look at them early and often. Obviously, you'll have ample opportunity to re-title your work after it's accepted by a publisher, but so many titles (of even terrific manuscripts) are so ill-thought out or just plain bad (meaning awful) that I find I have to get over that initial reaction in order to give a collection its due.

10) Once you have created an order that you love, think about dividing the book into separate sections. You may or not elect to go with distinct sections, but this process will encourage you to think even more deeply about your order, and about what makes a book a book. When you see patterns emerging, you might want to go back and think yet again about revision, about further opening up the channels that permit the pomes to talk to each other. Yes this is hard work. We’re poets. This is what we do. This is why it’s harder than the work of being mortal.

11) Weak poems. You know which ones. Don’t “hide” them inside the manuscript. Don’t’ include them. Period.

12) Other considerations:

a) Don't send in a photocopy that's been copied so many, many times that it has inherited smudges or the type has faded;
b) Try to keep your manuscript in the area of 62-68 pages;
c) Proofread for spelling and for grammar;
d) Proofread for big abstractions (“infinity”);
e) Proofread for small abstractions (“dark”);
f) Proofread for adverbs (“carefully”);
g) Proofread for mannerisms (i.e., have you use the word “pale” 20 times? do you tend to sew up your poems with something plangent and orphic? do you tend to begin your poems with a line or two of throat clearing?);

h) Number only the pages of actual poetry, beginning with the first page of poetry;

i) Do send a cover letter if you like, but never a c.v., and if you do send a cover letter, make sure it's addressed to the intended press and not some other press (you'd be surprised), and don't address your cover letter to the contest judge (you'd be surprised), and don't say you're in the process of a complete revision and will be sending the revised manuscript in a week or two (you'd be surprised);

j) Don't included dedications and thanks on a contest manuscript—there will be plenty of time for that later;

k) Be judicious about epigraphs—they're just so much hardware unless a poem clearly addresses or plays off of the epigraph;

l) Beware the epigraphs that you choose to begin the book or to announce different sections. Ask yourself whether they’re really important. Do you really want your own language to follow Rilke’s or Bishop’s language?

these as a reviewer have been important keys into certain ms., but often they seem snobby and random -- though this brings up two things

the quotes which are part of the mss. in a stronger sense -- not just lead ins -- tend to get lumped into the idea of "epigraphs"

and the division, not across formal lines, but between more standard or academicised poetry (even that from Iowa, for example, which tends to be very swensen-sourced or graham-rooted in a specific philosophy) and COPIOUS NOTES and more experimental poetry and THEY'LL FIGURE IT OUT
posted here for comment --

this is certainly current "best practice" as they say in project management, but I wonder at the history of manuscript presentation, and the way it is taught and not taught in mfa programs (which no longer really lead to tenure track teaching jobs, except with rare exceptions)

part of this may be with the contest rubric, and the fact that readers are often recent mfas

Creating and Ordering the Poetry Manuscript
Some Ideas from Jeffrey Levine
Publisher & Editor-in-Chief, Tupelo Press

My advice, given as one who reads 4,000 manuscripts a year. Admittedly, a good deal of this advice is concrete, generic, and merely stylistic, though I suppose even advice of that nature has some value when collected in one place. As style is a matter of taste, you must take into account that what I say reflects my own prejudices and preferences. Other advice here concerns more abstract matters: what makes a book a book? What is the artistic process as applied to making a poetry manuscript cohere? What are some useful approaches to the art of transforming individual poems into a transcendent whole?

The nuts and bolts:

1) Use 11 or 12 point font, Times Roman or other clean serif (Garamond or Palatino, for example), nothing smaller, nothing larger, unless graphic representation is an intrinsic component of you creative process. For example, I usually have more patience for a smaller font size when reading experimental work. Still, have mercy.

2) Beware the frontispiece poem (that poem of yours that you might have elected to place before your numbered pages or before your table of contents). This practice draws far too much attention to a single poem and, in my experience, the selected poem more often than not (80% of the time?) turns out to be one of the weakest poems in the collection. There is simply too much pressure on a poem that not only leads off a manuscript, but stands alone.

There are two things about this -- one is that witha paucity of reviewers able to, apparently, read, the frontispiece poem, the title poem, the poem -- no matter where its placement -- that tips the poetic hand, flags all the signs, etc. -- is a great convenience

I have an ms. where the title is from a poem that isn't -- was never intended to be -- the "title" poem --

3) Use decent quality paper, but don’t go overboard. It makes me nuts when I get a manuscript printed on expensive paper. It’s wasteful and indulgent.

this is a survival from I think my own undergrad experience, where we had to hand everything in printed on rag --

4) When ordering poems in your manuscript, pay no attention (none!) to which poems have been published (and where), and which poems not. At the conclusion of contests, I often (call me perverse) go back and look at acknowledgment pages. I find that most poets place an inordinate and mistaken reliance on their publishing history in ordering poems (or in deciding to include certain poems). Many of us assume that because a journal editor smiled on a particular poem that it must be better than the poems not taken, or that a poem taken by Poetry or the Paris Review must be better than one taken by a lesser known print or online publication. I am almost always amazed—amazed—by which poems have been taken and which not, and by whom. Nothing could be less relevant to creating a manuscript. If you believe your poems, and believe they belong in a particular manuscript, then include them and order them according to your own aesthetic judgment. Period. If that poem the New Yorker took doesn’t work in this particular manuscript, save if for another book.